KGB 3.78

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MrJackDaniels
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by MrJackDaniels » Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:23 pm

potbot wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:02 pm
MrJackDaniels wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:31 pm
potbot wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:48 am

Ah, variance is huge.

What ROI have you recieved with KGB? How many sngs or mtts?
I got 30%+ ROI over a mid 5 figure MTT amount with avg 350 players
Thats very good. And a mid 5 figure is like 50 000? :)
What was the average buy-in?
Anything from $0.01 up to $50. Try to avoid turbos as there is a higher variance and they need a more aggressive style

LuckyCharlie
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by LuckyCharlie » Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:28 pm

MrJackDaniels wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:18 pm
LuckyCharlie wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:58 am
I have played 280 SnGs (1$ and 2$ 9max turbo)
So far ROI -20%, ITM 33%.
After analysing all hands played I have no concerns about profile, it plays very solid poker.

One thing I noticed though, when there are less then 5 opponents left and everyone has short stack, bot often puts 30-40% of stack to raise with a blocker hand, any suited Q, J and quite a lot of suited connectors when everyone folded behind. Overall tactics looks good, but when opponent 3bets all-in - bot folds. Did you guys made any adjustments in this scenario? Unfortunately my sample size is not big enough to tell that it is a leak or just luck not on my side, but would be helpful to find opinion of yours.

My thoughts are that it might be an option to go all-in with a blocker instead of minraising big part of stack. With suited connectors I think it's ok to fold them more often as they do not have much EV in this scenario

Thanks, Charlie
KGB has no bubble code. It plays at 6 players the same way as it do at 4 players (bubble)
Yes, I know. Maybe just expressed myself not in the best way. I mentioned about less then 5 players to say that stacks are short and you have more situations when everyone behind you folds.

LuckyCharlie
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by LuckyCharlie » Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:53 pm

potbot wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:19 pm
LuckyCharlie wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:58 am
I have played 280 SnGs (1$ and 2$ 9max turbo)
So far ROI -20%, ITM 33%.
After analysing all hands played I have no concerns about profile, it plays very solid poker.

One thing I noticed though, when there are less then 5 opponents left and everyone has short stack, bot often puts 30-40% of stack to raise with a blocker hand, any suited Q, J and quite a lot of suited connectors when everyone folded behind. Overall tactics looks good, but when opponent 3bets all-in - bot folds. Did you guys made any adjustments in this scenario? Unfortunately my sample size is not big enough to tell that it is a leak or just luck not on my side, but would be helpful to find opinion of yours.

My thoughts are that it might be an option to go all-in with a blocker instead of minraising big part of stack. With suited connectors I think it's ok to fold them more often as they do not have much EV in this scenario

Thanks, Charlie
Is the - before your ROI a minus sign? ROI negative?

I also noticed that it sometimes raises 3x vs shortstack players with 10bb and then fold to a shove instead of pushing allin directly.
The heads up play needs improvement, for instance he never limps the bu always raise when he decide to play.
Imo he donk bluff the flop too much also, however im suprised how often he gets away with it. And he cbets maybe a bit too much on some bad flop textures. He rarely cbets turn.
I have often seen the bot go in with a huge lead heads up and then end up losing. If I had taken over i would propably have won most of them.
Yes, my ROI is very negative so far. But poker is about decisions, not a results, right? 😁 Will update you guys later on. Might change a poker room as well, on my current there are no standard SnGs, only turbos. Like Mr. JD mentioned, KGB is better for regular tournaments as it's very tight.

potbot
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by potbot » Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:21 pm

Bot is now down 30 BI :( and ROI now negative just over 200 sngs

LuckyCharlie
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by LuckyCharlie » Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:33 pm

potbot wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:21 pm
Bot is now down 30 BI :( and ROI now negative just over 200 sngs
Do you have any poker database management software like PT or HM? Just review all hands and see if there are any incorrect play. If no major odd play found - then just continue playing. When you play solid poker - this game becomes more as a psychology and mindset game. Keep going, 200 sng is really just nothing. Make sure you've read Mr JackDaniels post about 10 years of botting experience. Downswings are part of the game. Sometimes they happen when you have a lot of profit already, but sometimes when you just started so you're going into negative numbers. Ether way it's ok.

potbot
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by potbot » Fri Feb 15, 2019 9:15 am

My trial of PT has expired, might get it though.
It could be variance but the bot have also made a couple of weird moves and plays I dont like. So might need to review all the hands it has played.
Dont know how common 30 BI downswings are at the 3 dollar 9player regular sngs, I guess it also depends on your overall abillity and ROI. Either way its disencouraging.

MrJackDaniels
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by MrJackDaniels » Fri Feb 15, 2019 9:37 am

potbot wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 9:15 am
My trial of PT has expired, might get it though.
It could be variance but the bot have also made a couple of weird moves and plays I dont like. So might need to review all the hands it has played.
Dont know how common 30 BI downswings are at the 3 dollar 9player regular sngs, I guess it also depends on your overall abillity and ROI. Either way its disencouraging.
I made a short variance calculation of your stats and this is what I got:

$-128 - $304 (997 out of 1000 samples)
-19% - 46% ROI

So with that amount of games (200) you can easily face a downswing of 40+ BIs. I would say the critical mass is 50BIs. So if you drop down below 50, there has to be something wrong.

NotEC3
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by NotEC3 » Fri Feb 15, 2019 1:51 pm

Check out your BB/100 as well. Learned that from Jack. I've seen various discussions on how accurate it truly is but if it stays in the red it could be a problem.

RandomName
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by RandomName » Fri Feb 15, 2019 2:18 pm

Between KGB and more so WebMTTAgg, I was up 200BB in about 6 weeks (approx. 500 tournaments). And then over the next 142 tournaments, I'm down 50BB or so :(

About the only thing I can figure out is that I've had to play more turbos given lack of good non-turbos for my buy-in level.

I'm also going to review a dozen or so games in HM2 and see if I see any leaks. If not, I may just chalk it up to variance...unless, of course the bleeding never stops.

potbot
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Re: KGB 3.78

Post by potbot » Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:02 pm

Stats from 220 sng 3-dollar 9players regular tournaments

ITM: 38,18%
ROI: -2,43% (he had an ROI of 16% after 140 sngs)

1st place: 20
2nd place: 37 (lots of 2nd places probably beacause of kgbs heads-up play that needs improvement as I suspected)
3rd place: 27

VPIP: 20,79
PFR: 17,80
3bet: 4,93

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